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Can't We All Just Get Along?: A Reply to Black Shoe Diaries

On this, the night of the B.C.S. national championship game, I interrupt my review of the Mark Richt record to offer a few words in defense of interconference unity. I have tried and tried to promote good relations between the Big Ten and the Southeastern Conference, which is an objective in which some Big Ten fans are interested but others evidently are not.

This brings us to a recent posting from my SB Nation colleague, Mike from the Penn State weblog Black Shoe Diaries. Mike is a fine fellow with whom I have much in common, including a shared desire to see our respective conferences do well in bowl games.

When explaining why he would be rooting for the Buckeyes this evening, Mike wrote:

[S]omeone has to bring ESPN and the SEC lovefest back to reality. If you listen to them the game tonight is just a formality. We're only playing it because we have to. It's like a game between the Toronto Bluejays and Tampa Bay Devilrays in early September. It's on the schedule so we might as well play it.

Now, I have no problem with a fellow rooting for his conference to do well; Maize 'n' Brew Dave gave good reasons for doing just that, in fact. Let us not forget, however, that, one year ago, the situation was reversed: Ohio State was the anointed golden child and the Gators were the parvenus who amounted to little more than undeserving interlopers at the Buckeyes' inevitable coronation.

Even this year, Ohio State's place in the game was accepted as a fait accompli while L.S.U. and the other candidates had to fight their way into contention. This is The Narrative in action, but there is no conference bias to it; it's just ESPN doing what the Worldwide Leader does to serve its own interests. Mike more or less admits this in a later comment, when he recognizes (correctly) that the pendulum will have swung back in favor of Southern California before the start of next season.

Mike continues:

If you read the preseason magazines you were convinced that LSU was going to meet USC in the BCS championship game. USC's loss to Stanford couldn't be overlooked by the voters and computers. But LSU's losses to Kentucky and Arkansas could.

Mike is, of course, correct about the preseason predictions, but there is no comparing the games in question. The Trojans lost at home to a four-win Cardinal club, while the Bayou Bengals fell twice in triple overtime to eight-win Kentucky and Arkansas teams whose seasons ended on New Year's Eve and New Year's Day, respectively.

Mike goes on to add:

Take a look at the Big Ten bowl scenario this year.

Michigan plays Florida in Orlando

Penn State plays Texas A&M in San Antonio

Illinois plays USC in Pasedena

Ohio State plays LSU in New Orleans

Are you sensing a pattern here? Heck, even Purdue had to go to Detroit to play Central Michigan. Every year the Big Ten has to overcome this institutionalized disadvantage.


Much like the overused "S.E.C. speed" mantra, this is a canard that has been repeated often enough that otherwise intelligent people are starting to believe this nonsense. Neutral site games are neutral site games; the tickets are allotted equally to both sides and there is no shortage of Big Ten fans in the Southeast . . . which may have something to do with why the Midwestern B.C.S. conference voluntarily contracted to receive bids to these bowls.

My parents and most of the members of my family live in South Georgia and this year's Christmas scheduling happened to have me headed southbound on I-75 on the weekend before New Year's Day. After a while, I stopped trying to count how many Michigan license plates I saw. To their credit, the Wolverine faithful headed to the Sunshine State in droves. The persistent complaints about bowl games being played in California, Florida, Louisiana, Texas, and other places where the weather is remotely hospitable in the winter need to end.

Instead, though, we must endure the expression of sentiments such as this one from one of Mike's commenters:

I want to see these top-tier SEC teams travel up North once and while [sic.] to play. Other than 'Bama it seems like they either stay in the South or they go west for OOC games.

That's because Big Ten teams won't play S.E.C. teams in the regular season. Georgia's athletic director, Damon Evans, tried to get Michigan on the Bulldogs' schedule, but he couldn't get a phone call returned. The 'Dawgs aren't playing in the Midwest because teams in the Midwest won't schedule the Red and Black.

Finally, a commenter at Mike's site offered this tasteless animadversion:

If Adolf Hitler..........

himself were playing QB for the other team.....I would still root for Hitler's team to beat the team from the SEC.


Now, I am all for the spirit of rivalry; I scarcely make mention of the Bulldogs' longstanding series with the Plainsmen without reminding everyone that I hate Auburn. (I hate Auburn. See?) Expressing the intensity of your dislike for the opposition is one thing, though; stating a preference for the leader of Nazi Germany as the better alternative to rooting for a Southeastern Conference school, though, is quite beyond the pale.

I should hasten to add that the foregoing statement was offered by a lone commenter, and it does not represent Mike's view or the views of his other readers. That extreme exclamation of bilious resentment is not representative of the majority perspective. I realize that, and I want my constructive criticisms of Mike's posting to reflect my realization that, while some of what he has written is wrong, none of it is unreasonable.

We need to recognize, though, that there are lines that ought not to be crossed and prejudices that ought not to be reinforced, lest they become even more ingrained. As I prepare to post this reply, the national title game is underway and a back-and-forth battle is tied at ten points apiece. This contest and its aftermath should be about the game at its best, not the fans at their worst.

I don't fault a Big Ten fan if he wants to root, root, root for the home team---and, yes, Ohio State is the home team in New Orleans---but, when boosters from other leagues react to such things viscerally and take such things personally, they lose me. Mike is a good guy and a respected colleague whose conference homerism I understand and appreciate. Sooner or later, though, the time has to arrive for college football fans of good will to drop the my-dad-can-beat-up-your-dad playground act and begin behaving like what college football is supposed to teach the student-athletes to be: men.

Let's all make that our new year's resolution, shall we?

Go 'Dawgs!

0 recs | Comment 18 comments

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Michigan-Vandy
So when is the Nashville UM-Vandy game scheduled?  I'm sure after the Commodores went to Ann Arbor last year that the home-and-home will be completed in the next year or two.  Or, for that matter, when does Michigan come to Athens in return for the Dogs' two trips to Ann Arbor?

by NCT on Jan 7, 2008 10:06 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Rose Bowl
Last time I checked the Rose Bowl was always played in Pasadena, so if he has any complaints about that, he can take them to Jim Delaney.

by fotodog on Jan 7, 2008 10:58 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Big Ten (Eleven) is pathetic......
How about we do this to fix College Football's Bowl Championship mess....The SEC Champion gets an automatic berth to the MNC game vs. whomever wins between USC and the other major conference champions. Since the Big Ten (Eleven) can't seem to play after the second week in November they have plenty of time to schedule a playoff vs the WAC champion (both leagues appear to be of the same caliber), USC meanwhile could play Texas or Oklahoma (since they seem to be the only schools capable of winning the Not So Big 12), and the Big East and ACC can just play in the Car Care Bowl and no one will come.

If you couldn't tell the above is all sarcasm...

by RocketDawg on Jan 8, 2008 7:41 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bias ESPN
It's worth pointing out that all three talking heads on College Gameday picked Ohio State to win last night.  Here's my question.  How does USC jump Georgia in the final coaches poll?  

by nemov on Jan 8, 2008 7:48 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Talk about stale stereotypes
In response to the overused 'SEC speed' argument, BlackShoes points to the Delaneyesque:

"Big Ten teams are more disciplined. They're under control. They're smarter. They're better prepared. That's why we shouldn't be so quick to write off the Buckeyes just yet."

What?  Where's the evidence for that?  The SEC now boasts five head coaches with national championship rings and another with an undefeated season on his resume (an accomplishment that is becoming more and more impressive over time).  For better or worse, the SEC has lead the country in compensating its coaches and it has certainly paid off on the field.  

Who was the team getting flagged for unsportsmanlike conduct and late hit penalties every three plays?  Who was the team making smooth, in game adjustments?

I'm not going to comment on any unflattering inferences that may be drawn from the above quote since I am not familiar with the man's blog, but I'm sure I'm not the only person that senses them.

by TheUnknownStuntman on Jan 8, 2008 10:02 AM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

for what it's worth
last night both teams looked equally fast in all areas except maybe brain activity.  tosu made too many mistakes and they couldn't recover - LSU played a fine, gutsy, LSUesque game - and they won.

And, per the announcers, tosu had just as many (if not more) "fans" at the game - lucky batards (loaf of french bread - slightly wider than a baguette).

Personally, I was not rooting for tosu - I made the decision that I would root for all of the other B10 teams and not tosu.   Therefore, I'm not too disappointed.

I do hate the B10 bashing - yet there's no denying that the SEC has won the last 2 championships - without perfect records (a testament to their tough scheduling) - but with tough, aggressive, effective play.

Is the B10 disciplined?  The off-the-field tomfoolery this year would suggest not.  Regardless, I don't care for comparisons - the only disparity that matters is on the scoreboard.

by PSUgirl on Jan 8, 2008 12:01 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Michigan vs the SEC
Sorry, NCT, but that Vandy game was a one-time deal in order to fill an empty slot in Michigan's schedule.  And you're really talking now about games that happened in the 1960's?  Since I started school at UM in 1994, Michigan has played regular season games at BC, Colorado, Syracuse, Washington, Oregon, and UCLA, not to mention every single bowl game being outside of the midwest.

UGA has not played a regular season game outside of SEC country since 1966 (VMI - @Michigan was 1965).  I respect what Damon Evans is doing now with upcoming trips to Az St, Ok St, Louisville, and Colorado, but it's been a long time coming.  

I do agree with Stuntman's comment that BSD's statements re: Big Ten teams' smarts, preparation, etc are over the top.  OSU, to be fair, have been disciplined and smart most of the year, but have fallen apart the last three games.  LSU was clearly better prepared and more disciplined that OSU last night, but the same can be said of Michigan against Florida.  That generalization is just as true as the "southern speed" myth.  Otherwise, Chris Wells would have been tackled and Percy Harvin would not.

That said, having grown up in Georgia, I will enjoy watching the Bulldogs take on the Sun Devils next season.  

by georgiablue on Jan 8, 2008 12:03 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Vandy-UM
The reference to the Vandy-Michigan "series" was certainly (and, I hope, obviously) tongue-in-cheek.  I appreciate that the SEC hasn't been exemplary in OOC scheduling, travel-wise, but I find it frustrating when Big 10 fans complain about SEC OOC scheduling when Big 10 teams won't come to the SEC.   Scheduling is a two-way street.  Other than Indiana-Kentucky, the last home-and-home between the Big 10 and the SEC was OSU-LSU in the late 1980s.

by NCT on Jan 8, 2008 4:36 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Scheduling
"I appreciate that the SEC hasn't been exemplary in OOC scheduling, travel-wise, but I find it frustrating when Big 10 fans complain about SEC OOC scheduling when Big 10 teams won't come to the SEC."

What, the Penn State/Alabama series doesn't count? We would have been down there already had "Bama not asked us to move it back.

by nittanyroar on Jan 9, 2008 12:24 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Good point, joepadon
Much as Tennessee has, for years, been the exception that proved the rule in the S.E.C., so, too, has Penn State been the exception that proved the rule in the Big Ten.

Because the Volunteers play no annual neutral site games, have no traditional out-of-conference rival, and have Vanderbilt for an in-state rival, U.T. has been able to schedule more aggressively, and the Vols have done so, facing Miami (Florida), Notre Dame, and a variety of Pac-10 teams.

Likewise, the Nittany Lions spent decades as an independent and built up various longstanding non-Big Ten rivalries, including the series with in-state rival Pitt (even though the series now lays dormant).

Penn State, which has more natural geographic ties with Big East schools than with Big Ten schools, has continued to schedule well out of conference, for which the Lions deserve credit. Your point is well taken.

by T Kyle King on Jan 9, 2008 5:48 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Penn State/Alabama series
Luckily I have a stepsister who lives just outside Birmingham. I can't wait to go down South and get a taste of Southern Fried Football; I'm really looking forward to it. Hopefully whoever PSU's coach is in 2010 can remind Saban(if he is still there)how the Big 10 plays football.

BTW, good blog you guys have going here, keep up the good work.

by nittanyroar on Jan 9, 2008 8:11 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bama-PSU
I confess to ignorance of a Bama-Penn State series in the offing.  That's good to hear.  And of course it counts.

But I'll also add that, Penn State's 15(?) years of membership in the Big 10 notwithstanding, I still have to exert a little bit of mental effort to think of them as a Big 10 school (yes, even though this entire discussion was inspired by a Penn State blog entry).  I'm old-fashioned in many ways.  That's a little more effort than it takes to consider Arkansas and South Carolina as real members of the SEC, and much less effort than is required to think of Miami, BC, VPI, and even FSU as ACC schools.  As you might guess, it takes me a few minutes to name the Big XII.

by NCT on Jan 9, 2008 11:29 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nitpick
Georgia played at least 20 regular season games outside of SEC country since 1966.

10 at Clemson, 9 at South Carolina before they joined the SEC in 1992 (meaning, such state was not "SEC Country" at the time).

And why does everyone who cites that 1966 date (which is the one always cited) always forget about the 1967 game at Houston?  Is there some secret SEC team in Texas I don't know about?

And I think I speak for all Georgia fans when I say the Arizona State game can't come soon enough so we can stop hearing the same tired arguments.  I for one am tired of repeating the same "we have close regional nonconference rivals, so we didn't have to travel far to play someone good; would it have been better to travel across the country in the 80s to play a terrible Pac 10 team like Oregon State (at the time) or to travel 60 miles up to perennial top 20 Clemson?"  

by LD on Jan 8, 2008 4:54 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

quite the nit you've got there
I was merely scanning CFBDW and missed the Houston game in 1967.  The point is still valid.

Technically, South Carolina was not officially "SEC country" until 1992, but the point is with regards to geography and is still valid.  

Frankly, this wasn't meant to be a slam at UGA.  UGA playing Clemson is no different from Michigan playing Notre Dame.  There is a strong rivalry there, but I'd rather see some variety.  Given that most teams aren't scheduling more than 1 or 2 OOC BCS teams these days, I'd much rather my team (if I were a UGA diehard) replace Clemson with an intersectional opponent every now and then (I doubt UGA-GT is going away any time soon).  

by georgiablue on Jan 8, 2008 5:45 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're right
Many of us UGA diehard's would, in fact, rather replace Clemson with an intersectional opponent every now and then.  And, as you pointed out in an earlier post, that's happening.  And many of us (probably most) are very pleased.

by NCT on Jan 8, 2008 7:07 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's essentially what we've done
After playing one another annually (or very nearly so) in the 1960s, '70s, and '80s, Georgia and Clemson have played intermittently in the 1990s and 2000s, with a resumption of the series scheduled for 2013.

In the meantime, we're doing home-and-homes with Arizona State, Colorado, Oklahoma State, and Oregon---all of whom attended bowl games in 2007---and Damon Evans has made attempts (thus far unsuccessfully) to schedule Cincinnati, Michigan, and Notre Dame.

After a longer hiatus than any of us would have preferred, Georgia has resumed its 50-year tradition (1916-1965) of scheduling nationally.

by T Kyle King on Jan 8, 2008 7:13 PM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't forget
We actually had Cincy on the schedule (home and home) and they backed out of the deal.  We also had a 2 for 1 (iirc)with OSU on the schedule, but they backed out as well.

by peacedog on Jan 9, 2008 8:43 AM EST to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

SEC Speed
Just throwing out SEC speed is really a lame  and lazy argument. Like PSU girl noted, LSU seemed better prepared and executed better. Wells certainly looked fast enough as he ran past the entire LSU defense for the 1st TD.
Looking back at the Citrus Bowl, Harvin was definitely faster than most of Michigan's defense, but you can't run Percy every play. Plus, credit to Michigan's coaches they out-coached Urban & Co.
Some of the out-of-conference comments are valid for some schools, even UGA 66-06, but not all SEC teams. However, UGA regularly had Clemson & GT on their schedule which were both OOC games.

We can go on and on about SEC vs. Big Televen just like a Bama vs. Auburn forum, but the fact is that OSU lost 2 in a row in the MNCG and is 0-9 against the SEC while Michigan and some of the other teams have fared much better.
UGA will go out west in 08 and also play what is arguably the hardest schedule, even without traveling north of the Mason-Dixon.

by fotodog on Jan 8, 2008 12:42 PM EST reply reply actions actions   0 recs

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