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A Georgia Bulldogs Fan Reacts to the Toomer's Corner Oaks Being Poisoned: Thoughts from the Other Side of the Deep South's Oldest Rivalry

We momentarily interrupt this manic-depressive basketball season for the purpose of offering a few passing thoughts on the poisoning of the oaks at Toomer’s Corner.

Before beginning, I should note that it comes as no surprise to anyone that I hate Auburn. The Plainsmen are our oldest rivals, the rivals we have encountered most frequently, and, in my opinion, our most important and most bitter rivals. That said, some things transcend rivalries, and, as I noted in the comment thread regarding the sad news, this is one of them. Consequently, I feel moved to share the following general observations regarding recent events:

Star-divide

No, this is not analogous to Auburn fans tearing off pieces of the hedges. This is true for three reasons.

  1. As RedCrake noted, this was a premeditated act. At most, Auburn fans who go after the hedges enter Sanford Stadium joshing with their buddies, "If we win today, I’m going to get me a piece of that hedge!" I suspect the majority of Auburn fans who engage in that act do not give it even that much forethought; they just get caught up in the fervor of the moment. This doesn’t excuse it---it is a criminal act, and it ought to be treated as such; a few arrests and a few prosecutions would put a stop to that childish vandalism in a hurry---but "crimes of passion" are legally and morally distinguishable from premeditated actions such as the one taken by the Toomer’s Corner poisoner.
  2. A pilfered piece of the hedge is a souvenir, but its taking is not intended to harm the long-term health of the hedges themselves, and I am unaware of any hedge having endured such harm on account of Tiger fans’ vandalism. The Toomer’s Corner oaks are dying as a result of this act, and the actor apparently intended to kill them.
  3. Human health is not put at risk by attacks on the hedges. The herbicide used at Toomer’s Corner could get into the groundwater and endanger the physical safety of humans and animals.

Once again, this is not to minimize the childishness or illegality of Auburn fans going after the hedges; indeed, I hope this incident will make Auburn fans more appreciative of the fact that their attacks on our tradition are indefensible. The two actions, however, are not comparable.

No, this isn’t a reflection on Alabama fans. If any doubts existed upon this point, kleph’s rapid response put them to rest. It is important to remember that, as Warren St. John demonstrated in Rammer Jammer Yellow Hammer, college football fans tend to be passionate people for whom college football is but one of their passions. Any question of the truth of this statement may be dispelled rapidly by disrespecting the superiority of Southern ladies to women from other regions, the utility of the Oxford comma, or the musical stylings of the Drive-By Truckers in a comment thread around here.

The sorts of people who shoot each other over the outcome of a college football game are the sorts of people who shoot each other over matters of even lesser importance. The sort of person who poisons a tree because it is a revered landmark of a rival team’s fan base is the sort of person who poisons a tree in his neighbor’s yard because of a boundary line dispute.

Nothing inherent in being a sports fan, or in being a fan of a particular team, renders this sort of behavior any less inexplicable or reprehensible. While I believe the Auburn police chief was setting the bar a little too low when he urged "all the Auburn fans to act with the class we always act with," the rest of his statement was right on the money: "This is the exception rather than the rule. This is a person who obviously has problems to do something like this."

As Jason Kirk alluded to earlier, jury selection is going to be darned interesting. Given the alleged motivation of the accused, the attorneys in the case are going to have to ask prospective jurors about their team affiliations. Any member of the panel who answers, "War Eagle!" is virtually certain to be excused for cause, and, if the Lee County prosecutor has the slightest intention of running for re-election, he’d better use his peremptory challenges to strike anyone who replies, "Roll Tide!"

In short, unless the jury pool contains a surprisingly high number of UAB boosters, being a college football fan in the Yellowhammer State is going to serve as a virtual disqualification from inclusion on this jury panel. This looks plenty bad enough to those of us who, being impassioned college football fans, at least have a context in which to understand this extreme action, even though none of us would condone it; imagine how bad it’s going to look to twelve people without even that frame of reference to use in compartmentalizing it. If I had to put money on it, I would wager that "Al from Dadeville" will not find the exercise of his Constitutional right to trial by jury to his liking.

Beyond that, all that remains is to express the heartfelt sympathies of Bulldog Nation to the Auburn Family. This was not our tradition, but it was a long-established one, and all of us in whose hearts is a place set apart for Athens---home to the hedges, the tree that owned itself, and the state botanical gardens---are saddened by the news.

Go ‘Dawgs!

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I have always thought that those who do not employ

the serial comma were undereducated, and let’s not even start with double modals.

Great post, TKK. You speak with wisdom.

Audemus jura nostra defendere

by animalcracker on Feb 17, 2011 9:58 PM EST reply actions  

TKK, you know I love your posts although I don't get your passionate hatred of

the entire fanbase to which I belong. At any rate, thanks for the sympathy. The entire situation is as strange as the entire 2010 football season was.

I’ll miss the Toomer’s oaks.

And I hope your hedges flourish forever.

by aubgrad on Feb 17, 2011 10:04 PM EST reply actions  

This case could go to jury? Is it a felony to kill a public tree?

How do you find someone in Alabama that is not Bama or a Tiger? Seriously?

So, if this goes to trial by jury, then we have to have a motion to move the trial to mobile or something. Somebody will end up making money on this somehow. Book, movie, ESPN commercial.

Kyle, this post reminded me of your Red and Black days a little. This was a very nice piece.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:16 PM EST reply actions  

My writing has gone to hell. I blame the Tylenol 3 I am on today after the podiatrist cut me up.

Something, somebody and somehow almost all in one sentence, but with no cadence or rhythm. Yuck.

I think it is because I now believe I have no idea how to use a comma thanks to this blog and I am freaking out, man.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Ditto, Tankertoad!

Military writing has totally left me feeling “undereducated” on this blog!

Comma’s—I don’t need any stinkin’ commas!

If you're itching to change something, change your attitude.

by Inteljumper on Feb 17, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions  

Thank you - interesting.

But the individual in the link had a felony for burglary which impacted the other charges. I am damn sure if I am the current accused person’s attorney I would argue a life time of outstanding public service and temporarily losing his mind.

I foresee a few years in min security prison and / or mental care with a fine of around $5k. You heard it here first. I did stay in a holiday inn express last night.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:33 PM EST up reply actions  

First of all, thanks for your previous comment above, tankertoad.

According to SB Nation Atlanta, the accused has been charged with criminal mischief, a Class C felony punishable by one to ten years in prison. Even though I’m not sure this specific charge existed under English common law, the fact that he could be incarcerated for up to a decade triggers his Sixth Amendment right to trial by jury. Accordingly, the possibility of a jury trial is in play.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 10:43 PM EST up reply actions  

Criminal mischief is for real then. wow.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:52 PM EST up reply actions  

From what I gather, it's a legitimate offense with an unfortunately wimpy name.

“Criminal mischief” sounds like something one of our guys would be accused of doing while emerging from an alley on a scooter, but, apparently, it’s a real thing that actually ought to be outlawed rather than a ticky-tacky thing the Athens-Clarke County police can bust you for if you’re DWAFP (“driving while a football player”).

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Exactly! Criminal mischief almost sounds like fun! Or some ridiculous made up charge.

Criminal mischief to me would be like when I broke someone I knew broke into Sanford Stadium with his lady to fool around. Not a ten year felony.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 11:00 PM EST up reply actions  

It would have been a felony if Munson had been there . . .

. . . to give the play-by-play listing all the ways in which he was sure you the guy you knew wouldn’t be able to close the deal.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Minimum security prison?

Can’t something be done to make sure he spends some time in a federal, pound-me-in-the-ass prison?

by vineyarddawg on Feb 17, 2011 10:47 PM EST up reply actions  

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:49 PM EST up reply actions  

I quote this movie (as you have seen on FB) all the time. Sorry for thread jacking. It's Vineyard's fault.

"One thing I will never do as long as I’m at Georgia is lose to Florida." - Herschel Walker

by tankertoad on Feb 17, 2011 10:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes, I take responsibility.

I apologize. I’ll make sure to note my transgression on my next TPS report.

by vineyarddawg on Feb 17, 2011 10:56 PM EST up reply actions  

No harm, no foul.

Related to your freak-out over the proper use of the comma above, tankertoad, I am kicking myself for using the phrase “overly specific” instead of “needlessly graphic.” I’ve been off my game, too.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 10:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Auburn is an embarrassingly unethical, disreputable institution...

…and one of the main reasons I wish Georgia could leave the SEC.

That said, this is a bad deal, and the guy deserves a stiff punishment.

by Rangers100 on Feb 17, 2011 10:28 PM EST reply actions  

Rivalries are one thing, but, c'mon

I wonder if the UGA Forestry School could do anything to help. As with many things at UGA, it’s one of the best in the country.

by Will Fagan on Feb 17, 2011 10:37 PM EST reply actions  

If someone from UGA managed to save those trees

… they would have to be forever known as the “University of Georgia Toomer’s Corner Oaks.” Don’t hear me to be making light of the loss of tradition that this criminal act has caused, but I am pretty sure that the trees would view that occurrence as a fate worse than death.

by first and thom on Feb 18, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions  

I admit that I have participated in some of the lighthearted banter over at EDSBS...

… though I deplore and denounce the actions of “Al from Dadeville” just as much as anyone else. (For the record, I think Spencer Hall and the vast majority of commenters handled the issue well and avoided “crossing the line,” though as is usually the case, that cannot be said about everyone.)

Destroying trees that are older any living person in the world simply out of spite is inexcusable and unjustifiable under any circumstances. I can’t imagine what would be going through the mind of a person that would do that. I agree with you, as well, Kyle, when you say:

The sorts of people who shoot each other over the outcome of a college football game are the sorts of people who shoot each other over matters of even lesser importance. The sort of person who poisons a tree because it is a revered landmark of a rival team’s fan base is the sort of person who poisons a tree in his neighbor’s yard because of a boundary line dispute.

The one fortunate part of this case is that the perpetrator seems to have been so stupid that he practically came out and posted that he did it on Facebook, so there’s little chance that he won’t pay for his crime.

I would not wish this on anyone in the world, not even one of our fiercest rivals, and I also extend my sympathies to the Auburn family.

by vineyarddawg on Feb 17, 2011 10:46 PM EST reply actions  

Not an attorney

but with a 10-year sentence on the line, this case gets a plea. But if it did go to a jury, I don’t think his fate would seriously improve if the jury was stacked with Alabama fans. Most of them are aghast at this conduct.

While a good comparison for Georgia fans would be if someone watered the Sanford hedges with a truck full of Roundup, the more apt one would be akin to if the UGA arch was somehow a living thing. These trees are our arch, our gateway to the campus, and a living, breathing (omosis) one.

I hope Auburn fans move on from this and don’t languish in a cult of victimhood for too long.

Where was the Lorax when we really needed him?

by War Eagle Atlanta on Feb 17, 2011 10:47 PM EST reply actions  

I think a better analogy would be...

… if someone toppled the tower holding the chapel bell, destroying the bell in the process. The chapel bell is a revered status symbol of north campus and of Georgia’s early years of football, and is rung after every home win (and some major away wins, as well).

Nevertheless, your point is well-taken.

by vineyarddawg on Feb 17, 2011 10:49 PM EST up reply actions  

I agree that the case will be plea-bargained, and I agree that most Alabama fans deplore this action.

From a political standpoint, though, a prosecutor in Auburn could take a great deal of justifiable heat if he allowed an Alabama fan to be tried by a jury containing Alabama fans over an attack on an Auburn landmark.

Your Arch analogy is a good one, which helps illustrate the esteem in which the Toomer’s Corner oaks are held by the Auburn faithful.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 10:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Close, but no cigar

The Arch example is close but not correct. As someone mentioned, the Chapel Bell example would be the most fitting.

Reason being is that people do not congregate around the Arch for sporting victories… they ring the bell. The Arch is an academic symbol for our state and university and carries little weight as far as sporting goes. And our Bell has more history for sporting than the trees do, so we would truly know what you are feeling. From my research (albeit limited), this vandalizing of the trees started in the early 1960s; but our bell and its usage within the university dates back much further.

Anyway, shame on your loss but such is fanatical fandom. Perhaps this will serve as a warning for other universities to protect their most prized landmarks. For years I have said that I feel that the Arch is too vulnerable to attacks.

by Broa on Feb 18, 2011 10:37 AM EST up reply actions  

TKK

I just had a heck of a time trying to edit a profile and ended up making another name…

Holy cow. Broa is a dead accnt now since, for some reason, it left out the rest of my name.

by BroadStreetDawg on Feb 18, 2011 10:56 AM EST up reply actions  

Some of our greatest discoveries are obtained by accident....

….you just combined “bro” and “whoa” to make “Broa”. It’s much more efficient than saying, “Whoa, Bro…”, except it still sounds like “bro.” I think it can be improved.

Dawgsports grammar engineers, get to work on this.

"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell

by DavetheDawg on Feb 18, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

Yessir

I don’t understand what happened. I typed in “BroadStreetDawg” and it was verified at the bottom.. then when I entered in some information, it was suddenly “Broa.” I couldn’t edit the name within the profile so I had to ditch it.

Such is life.

by BroadStreetDawg on Feb 18, 2011 12:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't tase me,

Broa…

Where was the Lorax when we really needed him?

by War Eagle Atlanta on Feb 21, 2011 10:05 PM EST up reply actions  

The trees were live oaks.

The trees that were poisoned were live oaks, which happens to be Georgia’s state tree. It doesn’t make the crime any worse, but it somehow makes their likely loss more meaningful to me.

Regardless of what kind of trees they are, though, I feel bad for all of the good Auburn folks. I hope more idiots don’t escalate matters.

by NCT on Feb 17, 2011 10:59 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

I noted that, as well, and neglected to mention it.

Thanks for pointing out that detail, which I agree is noteworthy.

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 17, 2011 11:02 PM EST up reply actions  

Don't you kind of expect it?

With the state being so divided and so intense about the Alabama / Auburn rivalry, I have a feeling some sort of retaliation will happen. I know just reading the forums on ESPN (a waste, but whatever) you can already see how many fans are incensed. It only takes one moron to mess it up for everyone, as Auburn just learned…

Time will tell how the “Auburn Family” responds. Knowing that bunch, I would expect something in return for those bammers.

by BroadStreetDawg on Feb 18, 2011 11:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Lets be honest.....

First it was Auburn fans damaging the hedges at UGA. then Auburn fans put a scam newton jersey on Bear Bryants statue. Then Auburn fans placed national championship stickers all over Alabama’s Walk of Champions, the statues, and Bryant Denny Stadium. Then they planted rye grass next to the statues that stated the score of the iron bowl. Nick Sabans summer home gets painted with the rivals colors.
What happened to Toomers was terrible and in no way represents the Alabama fan base but Auburn must realize that if you deface another university’s traditional sites that a friutcake is liable to respond. Auburn certainly doesnt want to get into a one-upmanship contest. They need to take it as a lesson learned.

by burmbuster on Feb 19, 2011 12:09 AM EST up reply actions  

You must have missed

the part where the accused admits to doing the deed right after the Iron Bowl, long before all of that save for taping a Cam jersey to the statue.

Where was the Lorax when we really needed him?

by War Eagle Atlanta on Feb 21, 2011 10:07 PM EST up reply actions  

The bastard needs to be hung. Purposefully attacking anyone's heritage/home/traditions smacks of barbarism.

For me, it makes the argument against “Chop-Chop Square” a little less convincing.

If you're itching to change something, change your attitude.

by Inteljumper on Feb 17, 2011 11:21 PM EST reply actions  

As you all know... I've been advocating human sacrifice ever since the Goat Roast didn't work out so well

Any chance this gentleman could get weekend leave from FPMITAP (Federal Pound Me…) to attend the get together prior to the Boise State game?

"If there's one thing worse than chlamydia, it's Florida." ~ Emma Stone, Easy A

by RedCrake on Feb 17, 2011 11:32 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

And don't take this as me backing down from my original sacrificial subject...

I’m still hoping I can get Jared Zabransky to show up and we can have a twofer.

"If there's one thing worse than chlamydia, it's Florida." ~ Emma Stone, Easy A

by RedCrake on Feb 17, 2011 11:35 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

And it was insinuated I was overly optimistic in my other post!

The nerve! LOL

If you're itching to change something, change your attitude.

by Inteljumper on Feb 18, 2011 2:09 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm equally optimistic... that roasted Zabransky is going to be delicious!

"If there's one thing worse than chlamydia, it's Florida." ~ Emma Stone, Easy A

by RedCrake on Feb 18, 2011 8:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Based on the picture, I doubt it.

But I’m not going to volunteer to find out.

by NCT on Feb 18, 2011 8:02 AM EST up reply actions  

"If we win today, I'm going to get me a piece of that hedge!"

…I don’t know that I’ve ever heard that particular statement during a game, but I’ve heard a similar one with a different word for hedge. I never did understand why they were referring to our revered hedges simply as a bush, though.

What? Did I miss something?

by hailtogeorgia on Feb 18, 2011 9:12 AM EST reply actions   1 recs

People get the name of the plant life wrong all the time.

Another example: If you check out the live Toomer’s Corner webcam here, you’ll notice a handwritten sign on the light pole in the median of the road (on the left side of the shot). It’s been there for days.

Unless I’m mistaken, that sign says, “GOD HATES FIRS.”

It figures that the WBC guys would try to troll Toomer’s Corner.

by vineyarddawg on Feb 18, 2011 9:40 AM EST up reply actions  

Thoughts for the barn folk

I was reading in a forum/message board on ESPN an idea that I think would work well for the plains people from barn land. Instead of letting these trees die a long, public death in which they rot and disintegrate… why not cut the trees down now and make furniture to be preserved and used throughout their campus/buildings?

I know they would probably be in a tizzy at the prospect of cutting down these beautiful trees, but that might be a way to keep this legacy going despite the fact that their fate appears to be sealed. Seems better than allowing the poison to win the battle in the end.

by BroadStreetDawg on Feb 18, 2011 11:10 AM EST reply actions  

Live Oak is not

suitable for furniture. The crooked curved limbs were used as structural elements in early ship building while red or white oak was used for decking and hulls. Oak furniture is typically made from red or white oak.

Perhaps they could use the live oak for yokes which would be permanently attached to brain dead fans.

by JRL on Feb 18, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

You are correct...


Jekyll Island live oaks were very much coveted by shipbuilders here and in England because of what you pointed out. Ship internal “ribbing” sections were naturally fashioned by the limbs.

The scrap wood was then used to stoke the fires of local bar-be-que pits for ribs of another sort. Word has it that, even as early as the mid 19th century, Mr. Moats up in Sylvania was the official supplier of sauce. Thank God for trees. People who want to kill them suck.

"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell

by DavetheDawg on Feb 18, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions  

The more I know, indeed.

Well, my point remains that instead of letting the trees die a slow, public death you turn it into something that can be re-used within Auburn to preserve the tradition in some, small way.

On the bright side I now know about making boats , haha.

by BroadStreetDawg on Feb 18, 2011 12:01 PM EST up reply actions  

The neat thing about this site...

is it’s educational potential. A little later, I’m going to post how to rebuild a ’73 Ford Pinto 4-cylinder engine. Or bitch about our low-post offense some more.

"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell

by DavetheDawg on Feb 18, 2011 12:05 PM EST up reply actions  

Well stated

I, too, hate Auburn with an undying passion and also feel that this completely crosses the line. And I don’t think for one second anyone believed this was an act condoned by Bama fans, or anyone’s fans. This guy is a criminal and I hope very bad things happen to him.

Fake Pundit. Real Fan.
And The Valley Shook!

by Poseur on Feb 18, 2011 12:26 PM EST reply actions  

Agreed
I hope very bad things happen to him.

Auburn season tickets might be a good place to start.
/loves the trees
//hates the school.

"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell

by DavetheDawg on Feb 18, 2011 12:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Auburn season basketball tickets.

Actually, the Geneva Convention and Eighth Amendment probably prohibit that.

by MaconDawg on Feb 18, 2011 1:00 PM EST up reply actions  

WikiLeaks just reported....

they’ve been doing this for years down in Gitmo.

Does anyone even know how to bunt anymore?

by Chin Music on Feb 18, 2011 1:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Conveniently, GITMO is not subject to NCAA regulations.

If you're itching to change something, change your attitude.

by Inteljumper on Feb 18, 2011 6:53 PM EST up reply actions  

Trooper Taylor

says NCAA regulations don’t apply to Thibodeaux, Louisiana either.

The NCAA says:

"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell

by DavetheDawg on Feb 18, 2011 7:30 PM EST up reply actions  

GITMO, Thibodeaux...what's the difference?

If you're itching to change something, change your attitude.

by Inteljumper on Feb 19, 2011 2:53 AM EST up reply actions  

Well, for one thing, if Guantanamo Bay were in Louisiana, . . .

. . . it would be nicknamed “Gitmeaux.”

Go 'Dawgs!

by T Kyle King on Feb 19, 2011 6:49 AM EST up reply actions   3 recs

it seems some of the crimson tide faithful

are torn over whether or not they should support the “”https://www.facebook.com/TideforToomers?sk=info" target="new">tide for toomers" efforts to assist auburn in caring for the trees. i say it’s a no brainer.

Roll 'Bama Roll: The Champagne of 'Bama Blogs.

by kleph on Feb 19, 2011 8:04 AM EST reply actions  

Toomer's Oaks Poisoner

Dear Mr. King,

Thank you for posting this on behalf of the Dawg Nation. I have followed UGA since 1961, and I do not remember a single case where such a vicious attack was committed against the campus of any SEC university!

Considering the gravity of this man’s actions, he needs to be made an example for all fans to learn from. If convicted, and it is legal to do so, Harvey Almorn Updyke should be banned from the campuses of all SEC universities!

GO DAWGS!!!

by Jimmie Howard on Mar 3, 2011 11:15 AM EST reply actions  

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