College Football BlogPoll (Week Seven): Tide and Tigers and Sooners, Oh, My!
by T Kyle King on Oct 18, 2011 8:45 AM EDT
in College Football BlogPoll
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PrintAs previously reported, I am under the weather, and I am a resume ranker, so what follows may make absolutely no sense whatsoever, but, be that as it may, I cast my BlogPoll ballot this week, and here is my top 25:
Dawg Sports Ballot - Week 8
| Rank | Team | Delta |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Alabama Crimson Tide | -- |
| 2 | LSU Tigers | -- |
| 3 | Clemson Tigers |  1 |
| 4 | Oklahoma Sooners |  -1 |
| 5 | Oklahoma St. Cowboys | 7 |
| 6 | Kansas St. Wildcats | 4 |
| 7 | Boise St. Broncos | 1 |
| 8 | Wisconsin Badgers | -3 |
| 9 | Arkansas Razorbacks | 2 |
| 10 | Michigan St. Spartans | -- |
| 11 | Nebraska Cornhuskers | -2 |
| 12 | Michigan Wolverines | 1 |
| 13 | Oregon Ducks | 11 |
| 14 | Stanford Cardinal | 3 |
| 15 | Georgia Tech Yellow Jackets | -8 |
| 16 | Illinois Fighting Illini | -10 |
| 17 | South Carolina Gamecocks | 1 |
| 18 | Penn St. Nittany Lions | -2 |
| 19 | Virginia Tech Hokies | 6 |
| 20 | Houston Cougars | 2 |
| 21 | SMU Mustangs | 2 |
| 22 | Southern Miss. Golden Eagles | -- |
| 23 | USC Trojans | -2 |
| 24 | Washington Huskies | -- |
| 25 | West Virginia Mountaineers | -- |
| Dropouts: Texas Longhorns, Baylor Bears, Arizona St. Sun Devils, North Carolina Tar Heels | ||
SB Nation BlogPoll College Football Top 25 Rankings "
The nod goes to the Tide in the great Alabama/LSU debate, for the simple reason that the Red Elephants’ best wins (over No. 9 Arkansas and No. 18 Penn State) respectively trump those of the Bayou Bengals (over No. 13 Oregon and No. 25 West Virginia). As C&F rightly notes, though, this controversy will sort itself out on November 5.
The Country Gentlemen edged out the Sooners for the No. 3 spot, despite Clemson’s less impressive win over Florida State, because the Fort Hill Felines boast wins over No. 19 Virginia Tech and feisty Auburn, both by convincing margins. Oklahoma remains the top team in its home state, however, because the Cowboys (who had the less dominant victory over Texas) only narrowly escaped against the Aggies and watered down their resume with a win over horrid Arizona. The Sooners’ worst win (over 2-4 Kansas) came against a team Oklahoma State also beat.
There is, obviously, a significant drop-off after the top five, because Kansas State manages to sneak in, believe it or not, on the basis of schedule strength: Bill Snyder’s Wildcats, who built their reputation in the 1990s by lining up every tomato can, patsy, weak sister, and Division I-AA nobody they could find, beat two 4-2 teams (Baylor and Texas Tech) and two moderately solid 3-3 teams (Miami and Missouri). Yeah, three of those four wins were by a touchdown or less, but two of them were outside of Manhattan, as well.
I ranked Boise State ahead of Wisconsin by applying to the Badgers the same standards ordinarily employed against the Broncos. Yes, Wisconsin has the better quality win (over No. 11 Nebraska, as opposed to BSU’s opening win over 5-2 Georgia), but look at their respective slates as a whole:
- Boise State got to 6-0 by beating six Division I-A opponents. Wisconsin got to 6-0 by beating five Division I-A opponents and Division I-AA South Dakota.
- The Broncos’ worst win came on the road over Fresno State. The Bulldogs are 3-4, and they are the only team Boise State has faced that currently has a losing record. The Badgers’ worst win came at home against . . . well, take your pick: UNLV (1-5), Oregon State (1-5), Indiana (1-6), or the aforementioned South Dakota.
- Boise State’s Division I-A victims are a combined 21-18. Wisconsin’s Division I-A victims are a combined 12-20.
The bottom line is that what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Anyone who derides Boise State’s record on the basis of the Broncos’ soft slate must heap the same scorn upon Wisconsin.
The Razorbacks’ wins over Auburn and Texas A&M earned them a spot in the top ten as the country’s best once-beaten team, with the Spartans lagging slightly behind. Arkansas and Michigan State have played similar slates---Division I-AA Missouri State equates with Division I-AA Youngstown State; 0-6 New Mexico equates with 0-6 Florida Atlantic; two-win Troy equates with two-win Central Michigan; even a four-point neutral-site win over four-win Texas A&M roughly equates with a three-point road win over four-win Ohio State---but, even though Sparty’s win over the Wolverines counts for more than the Hogs’ win over the Plainsmen, a loss at Alabama hurts less than a loss at Notre Dame.
The Cornhuskers trail MSU because a win over No. 12 Michigan carries more weight than a win over No. 24 Washington, while the Maize and Blue got about as much benefit of the doubt as may be wrung from a quartet of wins over four dubious four-win teams (Western Michigan, Notre Dame, Eastern Michigan, and San Diego State), chiefly because the next-best alternative was Oregon, which earned points for beating the Sun Devils but could not overcome altogether a slate otherwise comprised of .500 Cal and Nevada, one-win Arizona, and Division I-AA Missouri State.
The Cardinal are in the same boat as the Ducks, only more so. Yes, Stanford is undefeated, but against whom? No Stanford victim presently has a winning record, and two of them (Arizona and Colorado) have only one win apiece. The Yellow Jackets and the Fighting Illini suffered less than impressive losses last weekend, but Georgia Tech’s was both close and on the road. The only aspects of the Gamecocks’ resume that got better on Saturday were a three-point win over Georgia and a three-point loss to Auburn, as both the Bulldogs and the Tigers improved to 5-2.
After that, the pickings got shamefully slim, necessitating that I reward Penn State, Virginia Tech, Houston, Southern Methodist, Southern Mississippi, Southern California, and Washington for a four-point road win over Temple, a victory over Wake Forest, an undefeated record compiled against Division I-AA Georgia State and five Division I-A teams with a combined record of 12-19, an overtime win over Texas Christian, a six-point road win over Virginia, a victory over Syracuse, and a pair of eight-point wins over 3-3 clubs, respectively. That left room for the Mountaineers, whose claim to fame is going 5-1 against a Division I-AA team, a quartet of four-loss teams, and Louisiana State.
Clearly, next week, I am going to have to begin ranking two-loss teams, which I don’t like to do until a team gets past 5-2. Which teams have I misplaced? Which teams have I overlooked? Which teams are ranked but should not be? Let me know in the comments below.
Go ‘Dawgs!
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Whew!
I was worried you’d rank Georgia like everyone else. Excellent ranking.
Success is never final. --Winston Churchill
Why a blanket rule against 2-loss teams?
Only I feel aTm, even with 2 losses, is better than many of your bottom teams.
For example, how do you rank SMU over aTm when, aTm beat them by 30 and only has a 1-point loss to #4 Okie State and a 4-point loss to #9 Arky. TAMU also beat Baylor, when they were ranked, and a decent Texas Tech team.
Why does SMU deserve to be in the poll over Texas A&M? Because they’ve gone 5-1 with a much weaker schedule and managed to beat TCU in OT? I can assure you aTm would be 6-0 with the Mustang’s record…
As you said, you’ll start ranking 2-loss teams soon enough, but not all losses (or wins) are created equal. It’s possible, given your ranking system, aTm is the 10th best team and has had the unfortunate luck of losing by a total of 5 points to not one, but two Top-10 teams.
Thank you for not ranking UGA, though, that 2-loss team hasn’t earned it yet!
"Don't go ninja'n nobody that don't need ninja'n!" ~ Kung Fu Hillbilly.
This is where I like Blutarsky's Mumme Poll
Ranking the top ten has been relatively easy the past couple of weeks. After that everyone has a lot of warts. The only tough call I had to make this week was K-State or Arkansas. The dregs below there aren’t going to be a player when it comes to the national title anyway, so who cares where they’re ranked?
by FisheriesDawg on Oct 18, 2011 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh...I agree...sort of
Since we live in a world where there isn’t a playoff, aTm has already been eliminated…
But rankings do matter to some people, like me, for I feel it’s easier to recruit as a Top-25 team than as an unranked team, even if the effect is slight.
Ranked teams are perceived to be better teams, and, thus, those teams generally get more press and national TV appearances. I want UGA ranked sooner rather than later (and they are in the AP poll).* Why should two losses to Top-15 teams sway voters? It’s not like we lost to Vandy…
Thus, at the end of the season, I care where UGA ultimately ends up, even if they were eliminated from the biggest prize when they lost to South Carolina.
None of the above pertains to the Blog Poll and aTm. I realize Kyle’s rankings will be more “accurate” (whatever that means…he does a better job than I would) as the season progresses, for many of the teams will play each other.
I am legitimately curious what caused Kyle to create a mandatory ban on two-loss teams, merely because said teams have two losses. For example, if Florida had lost to each LSU and Alabama by a point and slaughtered all other teams on its schedule (I’m glad this isn’t the case), would they not be considered better then many of the remaining 23 teams simply because they suffered two losses to the top two teams? As with any per se rule, it’s a bit overreaching.
In a real-life scenario, Texas A&M has beaten the same quality opponents Kansas State has and, additionally, SMU by 30+ points, which, oddly enough, is still ranked #21 and ahead of unranked TAMU. The difference: K-State is undefeated with wins over Mizzou and Miami, while aTm lost to #4 Okie State by 1 point and #9 Arkansas by 4 points. Thus, aTm is punished by having a more difficult schedule, and K-state is considered the sixth-best team in the country.
Luckily, at least regarding K-State and TAMU, these teams face off soon enough.
"Don't go ninja'n nobody that don't need ninja'n!" ~ Kung Fu Hillbilly.
*UGA shouldn't be ranked...
Until after the Florida game…
Don’t want to get too confident yet!
"Don't go ninja'n nobody that don't need ninja'n!" ~ Kung Fu Hillbilly.
You make a very valid point, Jman781, and my explanation is wholly unsatisfactory.
I’m sick as a dog. I’m resting on my couch right now, and, if I didn’t have to leave in an hour to pick up my kids (because my wife has a previously-scheduled work obligation of her own this afternoon), I’d be asleep on my couch right now. Moreover, if I hadn’t had appointments at the office the last two days, I’d’ve stayed home from work both days. As will be readily apparent when the podcast is posted tomorrow, I was heavily under the influence of cold medication last night.
Consequently, I didn’t have time to do an adequate job on my ballot, as a result of which I eliminated all two-loss teams from consideration for simplicity’s sake. I believe this to be a fair rule for the first six weeks, because it’s hard to card four wins that are adequate to overcome two early losses, but I agree that, in principle, some two-loss teams warrant consideration at this point in the campaign. Quite frankly, I just wasn’t up to it this week, and the deadline was when it was.
Next weekend, with the open date for Georgia and my anticipated return to health, I will give consideration to all legitimate contenders, including those with two losses. As I indicated in the subject line, I realize that explanation is inadequate, and perhaps it would have been wiser for me simply to have refrained from voting this week, but I thought it better to do my duty poorly than not at all.
In any event, my answer to your constructive criticism is to acknowledge that your constructive criticism is entirely reasonable and accurate, and to assure you that I will apply the perfectly legitimate principle you espouse next week. Thanks for the feedback, and for your understanding, both of which are greatly appreciated.
Go 'Dawgs!
No.
Fortunately, the rest of my family did, but me? Not so much.
That may have been a tactical error on my part.
Go 'Dawgs!
I think
it’s our special teams. It’s enough to make anybody sick.
I know…I know…
"If we score, we may win. If they never score, we'll never lose."
-Erk Russell
12 day snotfest
How indelicate can nature be?
Thanks for the explanation...
And, as I state above, you do a great job, for I assure you my analysis of teams like SMU, Washington, Houston, etc. is severely lacking and a Jman781-created poll would have as many, and likely more, questionable rankings.
Also, I’m biased toward power conference teams, which, after the Boise State whooping, should not exist, especially if I’m still considering the Big (XII-III+TCU-Mizzou?) as a power conference.
I guarantee, at least in weeks where you’re feeling well, you take more time and care voting than many who vote in “official” polls, which is why I enjoy debating these polls each week. If you merely ranked teams without thought, as I’m guessing many do, I wouldn’t value your opinion and wouldn’t bother commenting.
All that aside, get well soon, for we need you healthy!
"Don't go ninja'n nobody that don't need ninja'n!" ~ Kung Fu Hillbilly.
If you only ranked the top ten, though...
That top 25 effect wouldn’t really matter.
By the way, we were eliminated from MNC contention before we played South Carolina. Boise beat us like a rented mule, so there’s no way we would have ever passed them in the human pollls. And given that the collection of tomato cans on their schedule looks like it belongs in an aisle at Kroger, there’s not a whole lot of chance of them losing (fingers still crossed for the good of college football, though).
by FisheriesDawg on Oct 18, 2011 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Houston
I’m not convinced they could beat any of those other teams in the top 25, and many outside of it. After watching them in person against UCLA when they barely scraped out a win… I am not convinced. Other than that, I like it. Our game seems so far away!
Here's your Hate Week(s) Update:
- According to one source, Brantley’s boot is off, and he’s expected to start the WLOCP! Yay!
- According to another source, the boot is still on, and Brantley is unlikely to play the rest of the season, let alone the WLOCP. Awww….
- Rumor: a defensive starter might be transferring. Booo…
- Rumor: no one is transferring. Yay!
- The injuries to Jeff Demps and Caleb Sturgis are expected to be healed by kick off. Yay!
- There has not been one single accurate injury report so far this season, so they’re almost certainly out. Boo…
I understand losing the past three games, given the injuries and everything else. I don’t understand why following the Gators has become an exercise in riddles and Baghdad Bob gibberish.
Last update: Georgia is going to win. I am certain of this.
Oh, come on. Don't leave your uncle T-bag hangin'.
"Georgia is going to win. I am certain of this."
Words we have heard from Gator fans before.
by vineyarddawg on Oct 18, 2011 8:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Well...
We’ve got to win one eventually, right?
Right?
:-/
"Don't go ninja'n nobody that don't need ninja'n!" ~ Kung Fu Hillbilly.
Win, lose, or draw vineyarddawg
We are assured of the steadfast feelings for eachother.
(nods proudly)
On that point, we are agreed, renegator.
(See, it’s not actually hate week yet, so I can agree with Gators with impunity. I try to keep my irrational behavior limited to only one week a year, even when there is a bye week to play with.)
by vineyarddawg on Oct 18, 2011 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions
The second Georgia wins the WLOCP, they will be in the Top 25 then. They can’t ignore a team with 6 wins out of 8 games, especially with such good play in the SEC and tied for 1st. If we win.
My dad taught me how to make meat for sloppy joes and my mom let me turn over hot dogs on the grill.
by ChopMaster on Jun 25, 2011 7:25 PM CDT
by justincredubil02 on Jun 28, 2011 9:50 PM EDT reply actions
"Here in the National League where we play REAL baseball, DH means double-header." -Me.
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