In the last three years, Georgia has gone 16-8 in SEC play, behind only Florida and Alabama (20-4 each). In the last five years, Georgia has gone 26-14 in SEC play, behind only Florida (32-8), Alabama (28-12), and LSU (27-13). In the last ten years, Georgia has gone 55-25 in SEC play, behind only Florida (61-19) and tied with LSU.
In the last nine years, the SEC East has been represented in the conference championship game by Georgia three times, by Florida three times, and by Tennessee three times. In the last eight years, Georgia has won two SEC championships, Florida has won two SEC championships, LSU has won two SEC championships, and Alabama and Auburn have won one SEC championship apiece.
As Year2 demonstrated in the above posting, the Gators unquestionably have been the alpha dog of the SEC East since the divisional split in 1992, but the Bulldogs just as unmistakably have taken on in the 2000s the role Tennessee occupied during the 1990s; namely, that of chief challenger to Orange and Blue hegemony.
Georgia’s 3-17 record against Florida since 1990 tells no lies; more of those losses were blowouts than nailbiters, and a late time out in Jacksonville in 1993 represents the only even arguably controversial finish in the World’s Largest Outdoor Cocktail Party since Steve Spurrier returned home to Gainesville. However, the Red and Black’s consistently solid overall performance and ability to match division crowns and league titles with anyone in the 21st century demonstrate how wrong it is to argue that the ’Dawgs have fewer good days on the field in the fall than their SEC coevals.
What I wrote at Team Speed Kills, in response to a comment claiming that Georgia "always seems to have their best days in Birmingham in the summer rather than on the field in the fall."
Go 'Dawgs!
over 1 year ago
T Kyle King
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"In Birmingham in the summer?"
Does he mean SEC media days? ’Cause God knows the baseball team sucks there in the spring.
I believe that's what he means . . .
. . . and you are quite right that Hoover has not been kind to the Diamond Dogs.
I thought that was an odd way of putting it, too, but, since his user name indicates that he is an Alabama fan, I suppose it is understandable that his ideas about Eastern Division teams other than Tennessee center around the few days every summer when the entire league gathers in the Yellowhammer State.
Go 'Dawgs!
Good days... Birmingham... Alabama
One of these things is not like the other, one of these things just doesn’t belong.
"I want anything wearing red and black to tear the head off anything that isn't."
- Lewis Grizzard
by RedCrake on Aug 4, 2010 12:47 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Kyle, question from a Gator
My wife and I are Florida alumni. Her grandmother is a UGA alumnus and her grandfather was a trainer on the 1942 Rose Bowl team, one of Wally’s Boys, and had a hand in bringing Jimmy Orr to Athens. Since I got married, I watch a lot of UGA football as it makes family meals more interesting besides the usual banter out of the rivalry.
I ask this question and it’s not meant to mock UGA or Coach Richt. Your comment about UGA relative to the last 10 years leads me to ask the same question I pose to my in-laws: are you ok with UGA being in second place behind Florida? I agree with you and the overwhelming majority of UGA fans that Richt is a fine coach. The record speaks for itself. The “hot seat” talk is nonsense.
But, how many years can his program finish behind Florida? Is it ok to be second place? Granted, it’s not like that is chopped liver as our record also speaks for itself.
You compared UGA to Tennessee in the 90’s. I don’t agree. Starting with the first year of divisional play in 1992, UT’s only losses to Eastern division opponents were to Florida and one loss to South Carolina in 1992. They swept the East in 98. UGA has lost to a divisional opponent every year of Richt’s tenure. For all that Richt has accomplished, he has never swept the East or beaten Florida and Tennessee in the same year. That’s amazing.
It’s hard to read tone on a blog comment. I’m not coming here to mock as I enjoy this blog and your work. I think it’s a fair question. How many years can UGA continue to be in second place?
Sadly, for a while
For all the people like me who are tired of striving for silver, there are countless more that are willing to keep Richt around even if we never beat Florida again. If we went 10-2 every year, there are too many people at UGA who would be thrilled, even if one of the 2 was a loss to UF. Personally? I’d prefer the administration realize that 2nd is not what we strive for in academics OR in athletics.
Case in point: I think, and have discussed this with my circle of tailgating friends, the idea that if Richt cannot beat Florida in a year that, regardless of media posturing, we’re on a relatively even playing field, he may never even this series out. Florida AND Georgia are both replacing coordinators, QB’s and a good percentage of the impact players on defense. In fact, to my mind, we return more experience AND talent on the offensive side of the ball, so we should in some sense have a small advantage. If Richt can’t manage to beat Florida this year, I’m of the opinion that this will be the beginning of the end. He’ll have proven unable to best Meyer without gimmicks, which I’m tired of.
I know the question was addressed to Kyle, but I'll take a stab at it.
I think it’s fair to say that as things stand, Georgia is the second-place program in the East to Florida’s first. That’s a difficult thing to measure, but it’d be hard to argue differently. The only official measurement is season-by-season, and there have been seasons in which Georgia, not Florida, was first.
Since 2001 (Richt’s first season), Florida has represented the Eastern Division in the championship game three times. Georgia has represented the East three times. The perception of Georgia’s and Florida’s overall places in the division is skewed against Georgia due to (a) the head-to-head record; (b) the fact that all three of Florida’s title game appearances in the aforementioned period have been since Richt’s third appearance; and © MNCs. But the fact remains that in the last nine years, the programs are on equal footing with the number of division championships won (including title game appearances and tied championships that didn’t include a trip to Atlanta).
This is not to say that Florida’s not “ahead of” Georgia, over all. But to answer your question, “how many years can [Richt’s] program finish behind Florida?” About the same number of times as Florida’s program has finished behind Richt’s, based on what’s happened so far.
It's a fair question, Louis31, and I appreciate the spirit in which it was offered.
Florida possesses many institutional advantages which place it in an eminent position in intercollegiate athletics, including but not limited to football. Florida has excellent academics, top-notch facilities, a dedicated fan base, a moneyed alumni base, a great location, elite coaching, and a natural and fertile recruiting territory in its surrounding environs.
Few schools are able to offer what Florida offers, yet Georgia has all of these advantages. The only area in which there is a meaningful disparity (I’m not going to dwell on the fact that Florida has a few positions on Georgia in the U.S. News & World Report standings; both universities are quality academic institutions) is in recruiting, due to the significant population shift to the Sunshine State in recent decades. However, since the Bulldogs have always pulled their fair share of players out of the state to the south of us, this is not an insurmountable problem.
I agree with NCT that the Bulldogs have accomplished more in the last decade than they commonly are credited with having achieved, due primarily to the largely incidental fact that Georgia lacks a national championship in that period. (I characterize that fact as “largely incidental” because the only difference between what Georgia did in 2002 and what LSU did in 2003 or Florida did in 2006 is the fact that two BCS conference teams went undefeated in 2002, and because the only difference between Georgia’s and LSU’s 2007 regular seasons was the inability of any team to kick a field goal against Tennessee down the stretch.)
Nevertheless, the Bulldogs’ recent head-to-head record against the Gators is what it is, and there is no rationalizing it away. While the stretch from 2002 to 2007 (during which Georgia won twice in Jacksonville and never lost to Florida by more than a touchdown) gave us some cause to believe the playing field was being leveled, the last two series meetings were beatdowns akin to those to which we became accustomed in the 1990s.
In my assessment of Mark Richt’s tenure after the end of the 2009 season, I wrote:
His record against Florida is intolerable and inexcusable. The Sunshine State Saurians have multiple natural advantages—-money, facilities, climate, tradition, top-shelf coaching, a rich natural recruiting base—-but Georgia is among the few schools in the nation with the ability to match the Gators in these departments. While it is true that the Bulldogs were mired in lengthy losing stretches against the Orange and Blue under each of the two coaches who immediately preceded Coach Richt, he was hired to make up for their shortcomings, and, in this area, he has failed to do so.
The end of the Ron Zook era marked the end the days when Georgia could lose to Florida yet still win the East. For the ’Dawgs, the road from Athens to Atlanta (and beyond) runs through Jacksonville. That is the sense in which Georgia in the 2000s has been like Tennessee in the 1990s: being one of the top programs in the country while being unable to dominate its own division. (Yes, Georgia lost more division games in the 2000s than Tennessee did in the 1990s, but Kentucky, South Carolina, and Vanderbilt all have been tougher teams in the 2000s than they were in the 1990s.)
That has to change. I disagree with blackertai; I know a bunch of Georgia fans, and I literally do not know a single one who is “willing to keep Richt around even if we never beat Florida again.” Every denizen of Bulldog Nation desperately wants to reverse the trend against the Gators, secure in the knowledge that, before Florida went 17-3 against Georgia from 1990 to 2009, Georgia went 15-4 against Florida from 1971 to 1989. Winds shift. Worms turn. Trends end. Every ’Dawg has his day.
At some point, if the trend is not reversed (as it appeared in 2007 that it was about to be), Mark Richt runs the real risk of becoming Georgia’s John Cooper. If the Florida game becomes an automatic “L” in the 2010s the way it was in the 1990s (and the way it looked for the last two years, in a way it had not looked since 2001), the inability to get over that hump ultimately could overwhelm all the other good things Mark Richt has done.
Once again, I thank you for the question, and for the manner in which it was presented.
Go 'Dawgs!
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I might also add that circumstances beyond the football program may have given Coach Richt a little more time before any heat comes regardless of his record against Florida. When your AD has a major mental lapse which ultimately costs him his job, the football coach who probably the most recognizable figure in the athletic program and doesn’t seem to exhibit such lapses, is a hard piece of the puzzle to discard.
I get very tired of hearing this question, and it’s a question that seems to come a lot from Florida fans and Alabama fans. As NCT stated, Georgia has only been second to Florida in head-to-head record and national championships. The national championships are largely based on how the cards fall, so you can really only look at the head-to-head.
In my opinion, I’m completely fine with not sweeping the east (it doesn’t happen that often, anyway) and being considered (key word here) second to Florida. The college football world is very much a “what have you done for me lately?” kind of place, and if being considered as second best over a decade means two conference titles, three divisional titles, three BCS bowls (with two victories), being put in the position to win a NC (which is all you can really ask for…it will happen eventually, see Mack Brown), and a winning record against all major rivals except Florida, then sign me up.
Heck, just three years ago, Alabama wouldn’t even have been considered as the third best team in the West (behind LSU and Auburn and Arkansas), and now they’re being regarded as the gold standard, with LSU (and its two national championships in the past decade) in the second spot.
I don’t mean to sound callous, but it just rubs me the wrong way to constantly hear Bama and Florida people talk about Georgia fans being content with “being second”. I don’t think anyone is content with that, because the fact is, I don’t consider second in the decade as consistently finishing second. Had Florida literally finished higher than Georgia every year, then I would consider it second. This didn’t happen, so I’m not worried about it.
by hailtogeorgia on Aug 4, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
One more thing.
I’m typing this with the confidence that the series with Florida is not going to return to the level at which it formerly resided. The last two years have been beatdowns, and uncoincidentally, those two years were the two worst defensive years Georgia has had this decade, as well as the two best years Florida has had this decade (I count last year for Florida as better than 06, even though they didn’t win the NC). Tebow is a once in a lifetime player, and I am willing to bet that these same sort of discussions were going on after Herschel Walker graduated and Georgia completed the best stretch of football in its history. The series will even out, and it will happen sooner than later.
by hailtogeorgia on Aug 4, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
UGA can control UGA, not UF
and that means that sometimes UF will be better. Gen. Longstreet was asked about what caused the Confederates to lose the battle at Gettysburg, and he replied “I think the Yankees had something to do with it.”
I feel about the same. Florida has done exceptionally well, and even great coaches like Richt cannot prevent the other guy from doing great. Sometimes the other teams win, and it is to their credit.
I am more concerned about what the direction in which our program is moving. Is the gap widening? Are our teams giving up? Are there signs of improvement? If we are losing ground or losing competitiveness, I’ve got a problem. This year and next year will be big tests for Richt in these respects.
But do not misunderstand me – I ain’t talkin about moral victories. Losses are losses, and all losses suck. UGA’s success will be measured by its ability to take games from UF.
by first and thom on Aug 4, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
On a different note
How quickly we forget. No game other than the 1993 game has been controversial? What about the phantom face mask penalty that allowed Florida to get the winning score in the 2006 game that was tied 14-14? I was directly in front of that play, and the hand that “should” have been pulling a face mask was nowhere near it. Watching replays at home after the game on Tivo confirmed my opinion. Had we gotten the ball back, Georgia may very well have won that game.
I will not forget that phantom penalty and how it allowed Florida to continue on towards their 2006 championship. Just like the lucky kick against South Carolina, and the horrible call against Vandy in the endzone. That UF team benefited from more lucky breaks than any in recent memory.
that year did
seem particularly charmed for us Gators. I will admit, that upon seeing that Florida got the nod to go to the title game and face the mighty tOSU, I was both ecstatic and pretty worried. The last thing I wanted to see was rerun of the 95 championship. That 2006 title game for me was one of the first times I remember sitting there thinking, “Man, the teams in the south really are that much better”…now obviously the back and forth on that can go on for days, but I sure do enjoy watching SEC football.
As for the question about UGS fans, and being satisfied with second, I’ve never seen it that way. I’ve always seen you guys to be an odd bunch, and by that I mean that it doesn’t seem to matter how good Florida is or isn’t, or how good UGA is or isn’t, the UGA fans seem to believe every year that they should beat Florida. I’m not saying that’s a bad thing. Simply saying, that I’ve never gotten the impression that UGS fans were comfortable being second fiddle. I realize that a case can be made for UGA being seen as potentially Florida’s equal over the last decade, but that’s a stretch. Regardless, I’m one who knows the history of football, and that history is full of ebbs and flows…I know that one day UGA will rattle off a few victories in a row, so I choose to enjoy this time…..
I think it's all a matter of historical perspective.
As a rule, Georgia fans of my father’s generation view Georgia Tech as a much bigger rival than fans of my generation do, because my father remembers the eight-game losing streak in the ‘50s and the Bobby Dodd era. I’ve never seen the Bulldogs play the Yellow Jackets as a conference opponent, and I’ve seen Georgia generally dominate the in-state rivalry.
A similar sentiment is in play regarding the Cocktail Party. For folks whose football fandom is 20 years old or younger, it’s inconceivable that Georgia has an all-time winning record against Florida and dominated the Gators for most of their history . . . but it’s true.
Although those of us who are a little older must concede (as it took us most of the ’90s to do) that the current run of Florida dominance is no mere aberration, we think Georgia should beat Florida because (a) for half our lives or more, Georgia beating Florida was every bit as much the norm as Florida beating Georgia now is, and (b) the 21st-century talent and coaching gaps are not adequate to explain the lopsidedness of the series.
Go 'Dawgs!
Since 2001, every game in the series has been won by the better team on the field of play except for in 2002 and 2003.
We were the better team in 2005…. had D.J. Shockley started for us in that game.
What happened in ‘02 and ’03 is the biggest reason why this is still such a huge issue when evaluating Richt’s legacy. It’s just tough to explain what went wrong in those contests (dropsies aside).
We win those games, Richt’s record is 4-5 against UF, and we’d be talking about what a great rivalry this is.
Even if we lose this season, as long as we are competitive and give it everything we’ve got, I will be OK with that. That really is the issue here.
by get swoll yunel on Aug 5, 2010 4:12 AM EDT up reply actions
What went wrong
Those two really turned on UF having that bye the week before. I know after our epic bedwetting this year that everyone has turned on the idea that the bye week is a huge deal, but these two games as well as the 05 game should stand as evidence that it is.
In all 3 of those years, UF was spewing FAIL all over the field going into that bye, then took the week to get healthy, simplify, and come up with a good game plan(i.e., what we should have done last year).
02 and 03 were particularly painful because we’re never going to stop hearing about UF’s dominance until we at least win 2 back to back. That was our chance; I don’t know when we’ll ever get another one.
















