Can the Georgia Bulldogs Duplicate the L.S.U. Tigers' Success in Baseball?
Recently, while I regrettably was busy not partying with Mike Leach, I argued for increased spending on the Diamond Dogs, which caused vineyarddawg to pose a reasonable question:
What’s LSU’s secret?
They’ve managed to be a perennial football and baseball powerhouse, while still managing to field a respectable basketball team. Perhaps greater study of their model is warranted. (I don’t know what "their model" is, but one does not stumble into sustained success in the SEC on the gridiron or the baseball diamond.)
That seemed like a fair point to me, so I decided to look into the subject a little. The most obvious component of the answer, of course, is the fact that Skip Bertman served as L.S.U.’s athletic director after a successful stint as the Bayou Bengals’ head baseball coach. The man rose through the ranks of the athletic administration in Baton Rouge from the baseball program, so, naturally, he took care of what previously had been his bailiwick:
When Bertman retired from coaching, he turned his attention to building a new baseball stadium that would stand as a testament to the program's prowess.
The new $38 million Alex Box stadium, with about 9,200 seats and 18 luxury suites, spacious locker rooms and batting cages housed in a handsome building of stucco walls and a red tile roof, opened this season. Paid attendance was 403,056 for 42 games, an average of 9,596 per game, marking the 14th straight season LSU led the nation in college baseball attendance.
That, though, begs the question of how Coach Bertman elevated L.S.U. to that level in the first place. One reason for the Fighting Tigers’ present success is that they generate $2,000,000 in ticket sales annually and host about 7,000 fans per game, but, there again, something happened in the past that made L.S.U. baseball such a draw.
I’m willing to buy the "what-else-is-there-to-do-there?" excuse when explaining, say, the attention paid to Mississippi State baseball. Sure, it’s easier to get folks to a college baseball game in Starkville than it is to get them to Foley Field when Turner Field is an hour’s drive away. I have far too much faith in the Bayou Bengal boosters I have known to think they couldn’t find other ways to entertain themselves, though. They’re picking baseball by choice, rather than necessity, I guar-awn-tee.
Coach Bertman compiled a resume in Baton Rouge that borders on the preposterous: seven S.E.C. championships, eleven College World Series appearances, five national championships, six national coach of the year awards, and an 89-29 record in the N.C.A.A. tournament. He’s in every meaningful hall of fame for which he’s eligible. So how did he do it?
Part of it was the simple fact that fans will turn out to support a winner. Coach Bertman coached at L.S.U. for 18 years and Alex Box Stadium led the N.C.A.A. in attendance in each of his last six seasons on the job. What got the Tigers to that point, though? According to his official biography, it was "his astute knowledge of the game . . . combined with his steadfast determination and irrepressible enthusiasm [that] transformed LSU Baseball into the nation's premier program." Oh, good . . . ‘cause I was afraid it was going to be something vague.
Left with no other recourse, I went straight to the horse’s mouth and asked And the Valley Shook’s Richard Pittman, from whom the news was not good. Wrote Richard:
The short answer is that I think LSU's method of getting to the top of the baseball heap is probably not reproducible. It has a little to do with geography and a lot to do with timing. Youth baseball is particularly big in Baton Rouge and the surrounding areas. I don't know what it's like around Athens.
Also, consider the confluence of events that led to LSU's rise:
1. The emergence of a great coach...
2. In a sport that, at the time, had very little popular attention...
3. But thanks to ESPN getting started up in the late '70s and early '80s and needing to fill time..
4. Was getting a lot more attention...
5. But was dominated by a handful of regional powers who weren't always considered big dollar athletic departments (Oklahoma State, Arizona State...
6. And a football and basketball program that were about to go through EXTREMELY dark times (football in much of the '90s and basketball in the back half of the '90s) that...
7. Made LSU fans hungry for having success in anything...
8. And then therefore made LSU baseball a very high profile program once it started really having success...
9. And the emergence of a local phenom (Todd Walker) who probably could have been a high draft pick but wanted to play for the local team...
And the rest is history. With baseball being a bigger sport with more powers and better competition, I really don't think the sport is prone to having anyone else emerge as a consistent power. This is not to say it's impossible, but baseball in the '80s was PRIMED to have another couple of powers emerge and LSU was primed to join. That's not true anymore.
Well, dang.
What do you think, Bulldog Nation? Can the Diamond Dogs build on the success David Perno already has brought them? What would Georgia have to do to take its baseball program to the next level and become a permanent fixture both in Omaha and in the hearts and minds of the Red and Black faithful?
Go ‘Dawgs!
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well, being a south Louisiana native I should chime in.
I agree with point 1. Bertman was the key, but Louisiana is a big baseball state. I’m not saying that it means 90% of the team are from Louisiana, but that baseball culture is ingrained. Lots of LL teams, high school support (especially among private schools) and American Legion ball and it’s ilk. If you’re from Houma, La there isn’t squat to do in March, April, May and June other than support your local baseball team, bitch about the Saints and await football season. You have a higher opinon of the entertainment options in New Orleans and the surrounding area than my personal experience can validate. I’ve spent lots of summer evenings watching the Terrebonne Parish area Legion teams play ball. They were family affairs. That same local baseball culture has been a big help to LSU baseball. Tulane is no slouch, either.
by shadrach on Jun 26, 2009 12:03 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I have a hard time believing that Louisiana has
more prep baseball talent than the state of Georgia. Now considering that the Bengal Tigers have minimal in-state competition, then a modest amount of prep talent might go farther than here, as the program on The Flats is a going concern. But I would assume that the HOPE scholarship would be a huge advantage for Georgia over other states that don’t use their “lottry” money as wisely as the Peach State. Easier to keep the homeboys home. If our state has a problem, its that so many top prospects are so good that they’re skipping college ball entirely and going pro. I would be interested in some comparative numbers in that regard.
by Farsider on Jun 26, 2009 1:52 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Baseball culture
I’m willing to assume that Louisiana has a more deeply rooted baseball culture, reaching far into its youth, but it is hard to imagine it could be that much more pervasive as it is here in Georgia. Now, having always been the bookish sort (I’m being kind to myself there), the whole Little League thing carried on without me. But in my small-ish home town of LaGrange, I grew up down the street from one of the LL venues, and it was always a very busy, very active place. And just about all my peers in the Town of Elms and Roses participated.
Then, after law school, I moved to Columbus, Georgia. Holy. Crap. If you took the passion for youth baseball of all types and channeled it just right, you just might be able to storm the gates of Ft. Benning and challenge the 192nd Infantry Brigade in Taking the High Ground. I lived a block away from a LL venue, and across the park was Columbus High, whose outfield wall is emblazoned with a simple message, “THE BIG HURT”, in tribute to Frank Thomas. In addition to Thomas, Columbus has produced former MLB player Glenn Davis and current or recent big-leaguers Colby Rasmus, Reggie Abercrombie, and our Braves’ own Tim Hudson (who actually went to high school across the River, but is from Columbus).
And let’s not forget that the Great State of Georgia has produced a total of three Little League World Series Champions, and two of the last three (including the 2006 team from Columbus). (No team from Louisiana, incidentally, has ever won it all.)
by NCT on Jun 26, 2009 8:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think baseball is the least of our worries
We’re already there. We were a hair from winning the national title in baseball last summer, and even in a year where nearly everything went wrong, we still made the postseason. We’ve been to Omaha one less time this decade (2001, 2004, 2006, 2008) than LSU (2000, 2003, 2004, 2008, 2009) and would basically have the exact same resume if not for ol’ Stevie’s thumb last june.
No team is going to do what LSU did from 1991-2000, winning half of the national titles in a stretch of ten years again, simply because baseball’s profile has expanded too much.
Our football and baseball programs are on par with LSU at this point, they just have slightly better luck than us (our 2002 vs. 2003 football teams, both with losses to Florida; our 2007 football teams, identical records in the regular season; our 2008 baseball team vs. their 2009 team, though admittedly this LSU team was a little better). Our basketball program, however, is light-years behind it. They’ve got track, but our gymnastics, tennis, golf and horsey-riding programs cancel that out, obviously.
Basically, the only difference between us and LSU (other than basketball) is that they are better at getting lucky breaks and they use them to win the ones that really count. We can’t seem to do that for some reason.
by FisheriesDawg on Jun 26, 2009 9:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I would agree...
There isn’t much of a difference between LSU football and UGA football. The biggest difference between UGA baseball and LSU baseball is the fan support. Talent-wise it seems UGA baseball is very close to LSU baseball.
LSU has gotten some crazy lucky breaks in baseball in the last few years, but if you think fans can influence a game (and I do) then LSU has really helped themselves with their fan support. I completely agree with Richard Pitman about why fans started attending baseball so feverishly with the fact that our basketball and football programs fell on hard times…But you also have to take into account the sizes of the cities the schools are in…
Population from wikipedia:
Greater Baton Rouge area…774,327
Greater Athens area…187,405
That ratio (4.1) is very similar to the ratio of LSU baseball attendance to UGA baseball attendance last year (3.3)…
LSU average attendance…9596
UGA average attendance…2917
Baseball is not the kind of sport (and will never be) that will draw out of town fans in for games consistantly, because the regular season is not nearly as important in baseball as it is in football. And this is why I love the BCS but that is another topic… Anyway, in my opinion college baseball programs have to rely upon the local population to draw fans. As you can see above, LSU has a huge built in advantage because of the size of the city.
I also want to make one other point about this statement.
I’m willing to buy the “what-else-is-there-to-do-there?” excuse when explaining, say, the attention paid to Mississippi State baseball. Sure, it’s easier to get folks to a college baseball game in Starkville than it is to get them to Foley Field when Turner Field is an hour’s drive away. I have far too much faith in the Bayou Bengal boosters I have known to think they couldn’t find other ways to entertain themselves, though. They’re picking baseball by choice, rather than necessity, I guar-awn-tee.
This is true to an extent. There are many more things to do in Baton Rouge than Starkville, but Baton Rouge and Starkville have the same number of pro sporting teams. 0. This goes back to Kyle’s point about the Atlanta Braves. Let’s assume that Georgia’s youth baseball programs are every bit as widely spread and important as Louisiana’s, therby generating a large “basebally savy” population. UGA baseball will always have to compete with the Braves for attention. Louisiana doesn’t have that problem. There are huge Astros, Braves, and Rangers fans in Louisiana, but if the choice were to watch the Astros on TV or drive 20 minutes to go to an LSU game live, 85% of the people would choose to go to the LSU game. In Georgia that decision becomes, “do I drive an hour to see the Braves or drive an hour to watch UGA baseball”. It’s probably 85% or more in favor of the Braves in that case.
Win 2 national championships in 4-5 years, and the fans will start coming, but I doubt it will ever be close to what LSU draws.
by LSU Jonno on Jun 29, 2009 9:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How did UGA build Gymnastics?
We have an example of a team being built from the ground up in our gymnastics team. Youclan built the Gymdogs into the highest attended gymnastics program in the country on the way to 10 national titles. I vaugely remember reading a piece a couple of years ago that talked about how she built an exciting team that won, but she also poured a lot of attention into making the meets an event people would want to attend. She built great relationships with the club teams in the state (which also paid off in recruiting) and was a tireless promoter of the team.
Gymnastics is a self-supporting team now.
A good use of Youclan in her Assistant AD role could be in applying those same lessons to building some of our other teams who have a shot at being self-supporting, such as baseball.
by DavidJones on Jun 26, 2009 9:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
another thing with gymnastics
The Gymdogs, like LSU baseball, got in when the gettin’ was good. When UGA began to make a splash in gymnastics, it was pretty much a 2-3 horse race- Utah and Bama. Those 3 dominated for several years and they are still arguably at the top. Since then some other SEC teams are challengers and a few other programs like UCLA are putting out competitive teams. Even 15 years ago (gosh, am I that old), it was still the big 3 and everyone else. Kentucky had 1 girl that might have been the best all-around gymnast, Auburn, LSU and Florida had some decent teams, but really it was Bama & UGA for the best team in the East against Utah from the West.
by fotodog on Jun 26, 2009 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the UGA Gymnastics/LSU baseball comparisons are spot on
there are just those rare times in sports when a singular figure comes along at the right time and place and absolutely catches lightning in a bottle…it happened for Yoculan at UGA and Bertman at LSU, and because of what those two built, it will be very difficult for any other programs to match the level of expectation and results that those programs have.
I think that you have to put Dan Magill, Steve Spurrier, the track coach at Arkansas and the women’s soccer coach at UNC in there as well.
The coach has to be part P.T. Barnum, part Vince Lombardi and part Jack Welch. They have got to create an atmosphere that fans want to be parf of, they have to win and they have to manage the program with a level of expertise and cunning that will allow long-term, organizational sustainability.
In short, UGA cannot have what LSU does in baseball, because LSU already has it and it is not going away. Now, when Bertman no longer has a hand in the program, and someone else comes along who does not understand the vision and how to embrace the expectations, maybe someone else in the SEC can steal the Crown.
I fear that that may be about to happen in gymnastics. I know nothing about Jay Clark, except that he is not Yoculan. If he does not have the imagination, organizational forethought and ability to win, someone else in the SEC will have a chance to become what UGA is.
Look at what happened to UK basketball when they lost the organizational capacity and inability to appreciate the expectations of their program. They allowed Billy Donovan to build a program from scratch at UF
The beauty of these sports is that they are won on the field. At the end of the day, it’s put up or shut up, and these programs are great because they have won tournaments against the best competition in the country.
I hesitate to put Spurrier in the group, because SEC football is already built. Although historically an absolute nothing program, UF still had sellout crowds and expectations before Spurrier arrived. Still, he built a championship program from scratch.
by Fred Pen on Jun 26, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would also add that
Spurrier’s arrival at UF coincided with the explosion in popularity of Gatorade, and that the money generated by that product helped fuel the organizational ability that UF built.
No real UGA fan would EVER drink Gatorade, because that product is more responsible for UF’s athletic and academic success than any coach or professor.
Women’s softball in the SEC is clearly at the point right now where several programs are vying to be the model. The PAC-10 has enjoyed a monopoly in the sport for decades, but the SEC showed this year that that is about to end. UGa, Ufk, Bama or UF are going to be the first one to break through and win, and they may go on a huge run.
by Fred Pen on Jun 26, 2009 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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